[ art / civ / cult / cyb / diy / drg / feels / layer / lit / λ / q / r / sci / sec / tech / w / zzz ] archive provided by lainchan.jp

lainchan archive - /cyb/ - 31030

File: 1466017055502.png (17.75 KB, 300x300, blog-0.jpg)


What's good, lains? I recently inherited a ton of Urbit planets. https://urbit.org/

Think of Urbit as Bitcoin for digital land -- specifically, address space in a protocol. Like IPv7, but better, with a virtual machine on top. Think of it as the most cyb thing you can possibly imagine.

If you want a planet, post an email address in this thread.




from https://urbit.org/posts/address-space/

"An identity system has three goals: a name wants to be /secure/, /human-meaningful/, and /decentralized/. A principle called "Zooko’s triangle" says that /a practical identity system can achieve any two/ of these goals."

The art of OS design is the art of using strategic tradeoffs to almost solve unsolvable problems. Urbit's goals are to be secure, /human-memorable/, and /eventually decentralized/. We sacrifice meaning (Urbit is not competing with the DNS), and POSTPONE DECENTRALIZATION

Tlon Corp comes across as a pyramid scheme for functional programmers and Moldbug drones, for example, how much groundwork would one have to get done just to host a secure, legitimate Urbit node in say, Vladivostok, Russia? How much easier would it be to just spoof the same thing?





Hosting a node is a shell command. They're secure and encrypted by default.

Not sure what you mean by 'spoofing', but if you mean what i think you do, it's well-nigh impossible.






you part of team gamerfood? I used to talk to ted and a few others on cockli


I have no fucking idea how this works but I'm interested.




There's an embarrassing amount of emails being given out here.

>Think of it as the most cyb thing you can possibly imagine

I'll think of it as a "worthless p&d memetoken", because that's what it is. Have to wonder how many "tech-based" cryptocurrency ponzis are going to run before people collectively realize the word "decentralized" and stock images aren't an equivalent to feasable tech projects that will ever see completion.


I don't really see what's the danger in giving my email address out on here. It's using a pseudonym anyway, and what's the worst that could happen? Spam?


>what's the worst that could happen
A crippling humiliation that will tear at your being for every moment of your existance?

>peer-to-peer network of personal servers

CP botnet run on literal pedotokens. You can taste the bareley suppressed laughter without even reading the whitepaper, which I'm sure is a gem.


Thanks for the invite. Is there any way to get cash through it? Can it store things?


> can it store things?
indeed: http://urbit.org/docs/using/filesystem

> cash

not yet; but a bitcoin implementation is definitely possible.


for instance, code for the github api: http://urbit.org/docs/arvo/api/


Also what the shit is this image? Is it an abstract representation of infinitely recurring buzzword driven tech ponzis?


This reads more like a fucking advertisement than it does a legitimate post


just use maildrop.cc


or just don't sign up because its a shit website, lol


This seems like a really interesting concept, but nothing has been done with it.


What the fuck, is this website a joke? This was taken from their "Overview" section:

"What's a personal server? In a sense, you already have one. Your personal server is the combination of all the cloud services you use now.

This "server" is a mess. It's broken into 17 different fragments which are scattered all over the planet. You have no control at all over any of the pieces. The more we depend on Web services, the more we realize how unsustainable this situation is."

What the fuck, isn't this supposed to be what "decentralized" means? Yes, your information should be broken up and scattered across the world. Having all of your information in one place is how you get shrekt by the one person controlling it.





It's okay to be upset, but your banter game is weak. You should at least understand the system at a basic level before you try to throw this kind of shade. Otherwise, you end up looking like a tool.

I can tell you're skilled at trolling Bitcoin forums, which is probably what triggered you in the OP, but Urbit is similar to Bitcoin only in the abstract. You're going to have to try a little harder.


Sounds like a pyramid scheme.


Look, whoever wrote this drivel needs to rethink their career. theres so much buzzword soup in here that it makes me want to scoop my own eyes out with a melon baller. I can hardly read the technical documentation because of how obtuse and imprecise the language is. It's not even a matter of it being hard to understand, though it is because of the imprecise language. It's just painful to read.

What I'm seeing here is a psuedo decentralized IP alternative that no one wants or needs with some cryptonetwork soykaff poured on top. No-thank-you. Oh yeah, interesting tidbits:
"In cryptocurrency terms, Urbit is "100% premined."
"Three, most theories of property agree that anyone whoever creates or discovers new property starts out by owning it."
"95, to the Tlon Corporation. 50, to urbit.org, the future community foundation. 40, to Tlon employees and their family members (24 to Curtis, who started in 2002; 16 to everyone else, who started in 2014). 34, to outside investors in Tlon. 37, to 33 other individuals, who donated to the project, contributed code or services, won a contest, or were just in the right place at the right time."

I hope your network never becomes popular and your get-rich-quick scheme doesn't pan out, Urbit PR. I only feel sorry for folks that donate to you.


I'm skeptical, there is a similar post on endchan /tech/ about this, and I wouldn't be surprised is this on 4/g/ and 8/tech/.

I feel like this is an advertisement, and the concept is a bit stupid. I don't see how this is anything like Bitcoin, given Bitcoin is finite, where as anyone can pay money to use AWS, Digital Ocean, or hell building out Webserver, FTP server, or Mail Infrastructure on a DMZ in their basement. I don't see the point, and also, where did you 'inherit' the 'planets' from? I'm going to [spoiler]unironically[/spoiler call you a shill now, and take my leave.


planets are easy to get once you know the command


This looks most interesting to me, OP. Forget the haters in this thread; I am looking forward to seeing how this turns out. If you have any left, I would absolutely love a planet.


I'm gonna agree with some of the other lains, this feels like a shill. I don't trust Urbit it seems like a Ponzi scheme.

Maybe if the creator was a bit less pretentious and was more open about how the whole thing works, I'd be more interested. For now the whole project is too rife with buzzwords and startup-ese. The bitcoin forks are enough for me right now.


I'm definitely interested -- ashton@cock.li


Assuming you're op

You didn't answer any of my statements, except for the generally irrelevant one. Why? I'm still curious what the hell the point of a planet is?
This, this, this.

This whole thing seems like psuedo-tech trash. Can anyone confirm anything about this? And can a mod confirm that the people posting Emails aren't samefagging?

this whole thing is shady as hell


The people posting emails are from different IPs.

I can also confirm the OP is sending out invites, a few mods have received them.


A planet is like a server + a VM, but written in Martian and cryptographically owned by you forever. You get a funny name and can talk to other planets / interact programmatically through the Martian protocol with the Wired.

It's pretty hard to slog through the arcane glyphs and whatnot, but I want to spread the love because Urbit's talk protocol is
1) encrypted
2) persistent
3) anonymous
and in those senses it's literally better than tor. OTOH, it's about as bare bones as a carcass in the Sahara. I'm also not looking forward to diving deeper into the engine. But Bitcoin didn't get big because people were cautious with it. It spread by word of mouth among enthusiasts and tinkers.

So hate if you want, but this shit's cool.


I guess my problem with it is that the site creator seems to own an overwhelming amount of the address space. Also there's a pretty clear preference given to early adopters, even if they're just adopting because they don't have anything better to be doing. This to me indicates the building blocks of a pyramid scheme: "You'll be rich! Sell my product to your 10 closest contacts, and you'll become rich with me! Look how free and secure we can all become together! Plus these addresses will be worth something one day!!"

I'm not really interested in building another man's empire for him, that's all. It's a cool concept in theory. Then again, it has to be to be a successful pyramid scheme. I would like to believe the creators are doing their best, and that they just didn't put enough work into it on the political side of things. There may not be a good way to distribute their addresses at all. That's part of where many have tried, but none have succeeded.

I feel roughly the same about Bitcoin if it's any consolation. Great idea in theory, but I'm sure the guy who invented Bitcoin and a number of early adopters are sitting on a fat hoard worth several million by today's exchange rates.








You are incorrectly marking multiple different posters as "banter", in an attempt to defy some valid points. I reaply hope I never run into you on a bitcoin forum, because you seem to cause most of the so called banter


I ain't got time to feed trolls. Constructive responses get engaged with.


I've always wondered: Why should we play along with their address selling scheme?
Urbit is open source. What's stopping us from just creating a fork, not pre-allocating the planets and just handing them out to everyone that wants one?
We'd get all the benefits of the protocol without the gross Ponzi-Scheme lingering in the background.


Because urbit needs to be written first, and the best way to get urbit into a beta/stable state is to financially support the project. It's no trivial project, hoon and nock are like 20kloc alone. But no, there's nothing stopping you from a fork, in fact using an alternative root server is how you develop the thing https://github.com/urbit/urbit/blob/master/CONTRIBUTING.md


Then the smartest way to go would be to wait for suckers to pay it off and then building our own federation.


Oh shit, I've been looking at this for a while.



File: 1466095363734.png (397.07 KB, 200x112, putinwtf.png)

>"Despite messages between ships being encrypted, the founders state that they've purposely designed the network to make it as easy as possible for governments to regulate and control. It's not entirely clear why this is supposed to be a good thing."


Thanks in advance





Then why not just use retroshare/tox/some other project that's actually on the map and being audited? This thing is still in alpha and the security flaws are probably enormous. It seems like a bad idea to use this as a means to pass sekrit messages around.


File: 1466100607593.png (11.09 KB, 200x100, Oekaki.png)



Their own website says it's insecure. This whole thing looks shady as fuck, and OP is definitely a shill.



Always remember: If you're not paying, you're the product.
By putting content on or even just using Urbit, you're generating the value that will then allow Yarwin to sell those addresses in the future.


File: 1466113593956.png (22.9 KB, 200x187, rare-gendo.jpg)

I'm intrigued OP, please do send one to the email provided in the field.
If for some reason the address is not contained in the field, $ tail the image.






Absolutely right.
No one in their right mind would use this as a primary means of anything, as it stands now especially.

I just came to quickly evaluate the shilled product.
If it's okay I'll keep it in mind, if it sucks I'll keep that in mind as well.
For the lulz as they say.

Will I use it fully? Probably no, as I hate anything away from home or with external dependencies.
I don't need an extra leash, it's bad enough as it is already.


Fun fact, the lead dev on this project (moldbug) is commonly given credit for starting the "dark enlightenment" movement.


But seriously folks, etheruem does all this and isn't pants-on-head retarded.


>isn't pants-on-head retarded
That's where you're wrong. Etherbutts is a more clumsily redundant buttcoin with a few more buzzwords and layers of obfuscation.


ya lol, hit me up when ethereum has their killer app




I think the Blockchain Republic is the gentle revolution the world needs


What was that you were saying about ethereum not being pants on head retarded? :^)



Oh, so neofascists. No wonder they have the intent to make it easy for government entities to control.

>"Despite messages between ships being encrypted, the founders state that they've purposely designed the network to make it as easy as possible for governments to regulate and control. It's not entirely clear why this is supposed to be a good thing."

Seriously this is pretty cyb, in the dystopian sort of way. Would not use.


Ok... a VPS that's a "planet" in cyberspace sounds pretty neat...

But wth is this technobabble? Arvo? Hoon? They're trying to push a VM that's "as easy as an iPhone" - great. Now if I want to host a Python script that says "balls", I can't even begin to fathom how to go about that, and looking at the docs makes my head spin and hurt.

has it right




Sure, why not.





This thing is insane- and that's what makes it so interesting.


Ok... after reading up on this since I wrote this message, I've finally found out that, despite this being the first thing said on their website:
>A personal server is a virtual computer which stores your data, runs your apps, and manages your connected devices.
>Urbit is a secure peer-to-peer network of personal servers

they do NOT, in fact, offer any sort of Virtual Private Server! All that talk about "hosting apps" and such - you're supposed to Bring Your Own Device!

What the hell? Ok, a free VPS is, perhaps, a deal too good to be true... but I figured the very-limited VM was the trade-off. Sure, I'll live with whatever disk quota you assign to me, and I guess I can learn a new language in order to develop apps... but it's a "personal archive, application platform, and device hub" - all without an archive (no storage), without a platform (no machine to run your esoteric code) and "a device hub" only if YOU actually bring in devices and run the application on them.

So... what's left? What is it, really?
Well, currently, it's a namespace, with the idea that a planet == a person (as I read in an Urbit rep's response). The problem with that is, planets are capped to the same number as IPv4! There's an AMA on reddit's /r/urbit, and they say "isn't it more like 3 billion?" in reference to Internet-connected people. Oh sure, you're not on the Wired, you don't exist, the coverage isn't expanding (o3b, for instance) and more people aren't being born. So that basically invalidates it as anything meaningful.

I was really excited to see that someone was FINALLY bringing cloud computing to the masses! But, with no tangible product (no server), I'll pass on joining for the joy of developing applications in a new language, hosting them myself, and getting a subdomain.urbit.org hostname for it (when I can use subdomain.dy.fi for free, to get that same result).

"Your urbit is your own general-purpose server." -- NOT!


This tbh. I can't see the benefit of Urbit over just having a normal home server (which you'd need for Urbit as well) that other people can connect to through a Tor hidden service (that is free as in free beer).


Would love an urbit planet. I've contributed a little to the project but haven't gotten a planet yet. hanyxlanky@maildrop.cc




Free potential money is money potentially for free. Please consider me interested:




>>31418 >>31409
It's everything you've said, and also _cryptographically owned digital property and code._ Which, to be honest, is the real innovation. It's even in the op: bitcoin for land.

Imagine a swarm of moon servers running on drones, executing only the code they can verify was signed by the parent planet.


Imagine you opening your wallet and giving your money to a vaguely european sounding sociopath as he assertively whispers the words "blockchain" and "decentralized" at you, animating your timorous, sheepish figure. You carefully make your way across the convention to your tribe of grease slicked white twigs and do the same, though without social finesse.




Thanks so much kind lainon!


I read the docs, it's shit.


I also "own" my hidden services as only I have access to the private keys. If I want that certified on a blockchain, why not just use NameCoin?


File: 1466326017796.png (451.39 KB, 200x112, ayyyy lmao!!!.gif)


Does he wink at me? Please tell me he winks.

I always trust people instinctively when they wink and smile at me knowingly. Much more authentic than a handshake or lunch date. You know that you've just made a true friend for life who would never lie to you for personal gain so you skip the foreplay and jump right into speculative digital currency trading. Uwaaah! What have I been missing all these years? How did you know my name? Where did you get that fancy looking nametag?




hey guise i inherited a million on paypal please give me your emails


Sure, why not. Seems cool. niles@rogoff.xyz


Thanks anon, hope i'm not too late.


what? i missed the crowdsale? fuck




Hoping I'm not too late!





Please send money and land and servers and bitcoins and wallets and decentralized systems and books and the entire catalogue of Louis Rossmann



looks pretty /cyb/



I don't know what I'm getting into


Should get to all of you soon. Sit tight.


Hurry up, your boss will be angry.



Pls based OP


It's okay to be upset. Who could have known they'd sell out of stars in less than 4 hours? Everyone feels FOMO.


>still not received
pls op give me one too!


-literally written by Mencius Moldbug of neoreactionary fame

-AMA on reddit filled with sockpuppet accounts

-weird ponzi scheme/heirarchy thing going on


-completely obfuscated, written in moon runes, nobody knows what it does or how to use it

Nah, fuck this.




Tibru is an alternative to the nonsense that is the Urbit project. By nonsense I mean poor implementation, unnecessarily obfuscated source code and generally poor design decisions leading to high runtime overheads with little advantage. It also suffers from academic elitism and lack of reference to prior art which is rampant throughout its design and documentation. Unfortunately despite its academic roots the chosen runtime language is arbitrary and poorly selected from hundreds of alternatives.

This project has two aims. The first is to allow easy access to systems of this type by using generally accepted coding standards and techniques. The target executable provides an interactive REPL environment with human readable qualities. The second is to go above and beyond what is reasonably capable with Nock (Urbit's runtime language). This technology is open for anyone to use and lends itself nicely to app container implementations since it is side effect free and runs on immutable data structures.

As of writing no further work is being done on the system as it has met its first goal to implement a basic runtime structure.


File: 1467741602361.png (346.72 KB, 152x200, trash_identifying.png)

>As of writing no further work is being done on the system


File: 1467742177579.png (32.49 KB, 122x200, 1445858817705.jpg)

>unnecessarily obfuscated
No, it's intended. How do you think any of the other thousand meaningless memetoken premine scams work? People realized after ethereum that you need to build your tokens on a notional technology or feature to generate sustained interest. It's about making people think they're supporting an intangible concept by buying your aspie tokens for actual money.

Technical obfuscation and sockpuppet social proof are -the- defining tactics of the cryptoponzi metagame right now. Isn't much different than "professional development" cults and the like.


File: 1468915897899.png (276.64 KB, 200x134, CkrxvAOXIAA5894.jpg large.jpg)

Why even bother with a whitepaper? LOL

I need to stop trading crypto and start ponzi'ing.


Many corporations are basically ponzi schemes that generate some profit on the side to legitimize themselves. Most of their value is because people think they are valuable so their stocks go up.


You mean a server hotsting a Redis instance that has 2 slave and verifies the master's certificate before adding a task to their cue?

This is like normal server, master/slave relationships with existing tech but roleplaying with it.

hurrr i'll name my home server earth and raspi moon, and i can make my moon only execute code from earth (which is done already with existing tech).

They're selling you timeshare essentially.










So it's a currency with a layer 3 network address for a protocol other than IPv4 or IPv6 that's also virtual machine? Man, that sounds cyb as hell. Exactly how high were you when you made this post on a scale of 1 to Count Chocula?


>Man, that sounds cyb as hell.
So are Ponzi Schemes, I guess.


I'd like a planet.


Still have any planets left?



Thanks, I'll give it a try if you have any left