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lainchan archive - /w/ - 4767

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Why do they like Lisp so much?


it was the 90's


>>4767 (OP)
it's a much older programming language, plus MIT taught it as a intro class.

today not many people even know what it is outside /lambda/ and /g/entoo


The other two pictures are more recent though. "Subete ga F ni Naru"


Does the title mean "Everything becomes fuarrrked"?


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It's a mystery, Lainon-kun.


Truth is that is recent. But the original setup was a mystery novel, published around the 90s. That short int for the date is so pre-Y2K)


>MIT taught it as a intro class
The one in the screenshots is common lisp. the one taught at MIT as an intro to programming was scheme.


incorrect anon. lisp is HUGE in the emacs community (which is gaining traction for some odd reason) and azn counties (prob b/c of emacs as well).


I can't speak for whatever other anime that is, but lisp is actually a core part of the serial experiments lain plot. "Knights of eastern calculus" = knights of lambda calculus, a reference to a secret order of programmers founded by GJS Jay Sussman at MIT. The Knights of Lambda Calculus blended occult practices and programming to craft mathematically specified demons. This is why the cover of SICP has a wizard, and where the motif of "conjure the spirits of the computer with your spells" comes from. The language used by the Knights in our reality and in Serial Experiments Lain is scheme, taught in SICP.

If you read every fib number page of SICP, it tells you the origin story of the Knights of Lambda Calculus, but only the first edition printing.


People on /g/ mocked me because I actually run Gentoo. I hate that place.


i like the subete


Common Lisp has a big Japanese community for some reason, a couple of the compilers and a bunch of packages are maintained by people from Japan. It is weird because Japan rejected using Lisp for AI and prefered logic languages like Prolog (same for Europe), which they were trying to invent a new computer generation with in the 80s.


The Knights was something that somebody made up at MIT, as something that students joined when they finished 6.001, the introduction course (taught in Scheme at the time. Now it's taught in Python). By my understanding, there was never a secret organization by that name.


>taught in Scheme at the time. Now it's taught in Python
That's really sad.


>>Now it's taught in Python.
Why the change in languages?


>The "debate" had an interlude, in which Costanza asked Sussman why MIT had switched away from Scheme for their introductory programming course, 6.001. This was a gem. He said that the reason that happened was because engineering in 1980 was not what it was in the mid-90s or in 2000. In 1980, good programmers spent a lot of time thinking, and then produced spare code that they thought should work. Code ran close to the metal, even Scheme -- it was understandable all the way down. Like a resistor, where you could read the bands and know the power rating and the tolerance and the resistance and V=IR and that's all there was to know. 6.001 had been conceived to teach engineers how to take small parts that they understood entirely and use simple techniques to compose them into larger things that do what you want.

>But programming now isn't so much like that, said Sussman. Nowadays you muck around with incomprehensible or nonexistent man pages for software you don't know who wrote. You have to do basic science on your libraries to see how they work, trying out different inputs and seeing how the code reacts. This is a fundamentally different job, and it needed a different course.

>So the good thing about the new 6.001 was that it was robot-centered -- you had to program a little robot to move around. And robots are not like resistors, behaving according to ideal functions. Wheels slip, the environment changes, etc -- you have to build in robustness to the system, in a different way than the one SICP discusses.

>And why Python, then? Well, said Sussman, it probably just had a library already implemented for the robotics interface, that was all.



the real question is why they like solaris so much


>If you read every fib number page of SICP, it tells you the origin story of the Knights of Lambda Calculus, but only the first edition printing.

any chance you have a copy of that? I'd really like to read about it


/g/ is terrible these days
i am running gentoo myself and i feel a bit more comfortable with it than ubuntu i was on last


do i read page 1 twice then?


only after reading page zero first